Interview with Mr. José of Neves
Report published in the newspaper Varadouro, Rio Branco, AC, in April of 1981

SANTO DAIME: Master Irineu's Doctrine

There are numerous religious centers in Acre that use Daime. Daime, or Iagê, or Liana, is a drink prepared starting from a certain species of leaves and a liana, existent in the Amazonian Western. With the intention of lifting the bases for a subsequent study of Santo Daime's doctrine, VARADOURO picked some   depositions from people who live closely Santo Daime's reality. The interest for Santo Daime's doctrine, introduced in Acre by Raimundo Irineu Serra, Master Irineu, has watchdog the borders of Acre and attracted people's curiosity of many parts of Brazil, and also of other countries. Much has been written, but usually by people far from the doctrine's reality. As all this tradition has popular roots, it was born with very simple people, and was for a lot of time wrapped up in a prejudice veil that only now is dissipating. Our first contact was with "Conselheiro" José das Neves, acrean from the municipal district of Xapuri, baker by profession and close friend of Master Irineu. José das Neves has 73 years of age, 40 of them lived beside Master Irineu.

VARADOURO - How you met Master Irineu?

José das Neves – I was 4 year-old when he passed by Xapuri, and later he went to the "seringal" (rubber extraction area in the jungle) in Brasiléia and in Bolivia and it took a long time for him to come back. But it was  recorded in me the impression of that man, although I was in such little age. In February of 1930 with 22, I moved to Rio Branco. I arrived in February and Master Irineu arrived in March. When it was May he began his work here, in that time he was 39 years old already.

Varadouro–How you met with Irineu? You were invited by him?

José das Neves – There was a man who knew him and worked with me, and he told me that Irineu had arrived and all this. The reason I searched for him was that impression I had within me, that knowledge. And it was that knowledge which made me reach his work. He didn't invite me, it was my arrangement to come to him and take the Daime. In fact he never invited anybody. I also never invited anybody - who wants it goes.

Varadouro – Last May (1980) completed 50 years that Daime is taken in Rio Branco. How was the Ceremony?

José das Neves: It was on May 26, 1930 that began this work with him, and we worked until his death, 41 years and 41 days. On that time there was not uniform (farda) and the work was of concentration. We were three people. It's been a long time. I don't remember the other companion's name. In 50 years we forget a little.

Varadouro: Talk more about the beginning.

José das Neves: Our work began as a class. You gathers 4 or 5 boys, makes a room and goes taught and it is going to arrive more children, to a point when you have 50 or 100 students arriving. You go tuning, you purify the teachings every day. The teacher show how it is, the student learns the ABC. On that time it was the beginning of everything. From 1935 to 1940 is that the Master develops and receives the values of the doctrine, the hymns, the music which comes from the astral dimension and isn't invented in any way.

Varadouro: A school always form the students, leaving them capable. Did Master Irineu form a lot of people?

José das Neves: Well, he had many students, much more than thousand, but not all make the equal effort to learn. He has many cases of people that took the leaning seriously, and I will mention one: Maria Damião was a student that worked many years with the Master. She died in 1949, but she learned and received a hinário and for this reason she will be a person who will always lives inside the doctrine.

Varadouro: Have you received a hinário?

José das Neves: No, my work is of " Concentration ". I am Counselor in "Alto Santo" (the center left by Master Irineu in Rio Branco, conducted nowadays by his widow, Peregrina). A person comes with a problem and according to what we deserve at the moment I give the advices.

Varadouro: Do you also makes cure works?

José das Neves: Master Irineu made cure works. He had this power and a good part of the people that began in the doctrine it was because they healed themselves there. The one who cures is the Daime, but we need the Master's force. This work never existed before, in Rio Branco or in any part of the world. It was a secret of the forest. Master Irineu opened the knowledge for other people to come, till we arrive in this situation today.

Varadouro: Have you had problems with the law?

José das Neves: Master Irineu was very respected and was friend of influent persons from politics who would call for him in case of extreme illness in the family. But we started having problems when they invented this "toxic" and "drug" conversation. Now if you want to really know this brew, I tell you it is pure and solid, and I say that I've been working for 50 years with it. And if they ask me: hey citizen, is there any toxic part? - I say no. The Federal Police officer spoke like this to me – "How it is? Taking by you it can never be toxic. You with this age, with this body, and in your voice we hear strenght. Then there is no reason to be toxic".

Varadouro: And your wife? Did she always followed you in this work?

José das Neves: We are already 40 years living together and in these issues she never put doubt, because she is also taking Daime all those years. Now you tell me a thing, how many years do you think she has? - Well, I calculate about 68 years – So you see how things are, here is a woman who does the whole service of the house and is good for everything. She is eight years older than me therefore she is already with 80 years old.

Varadouro: I believe in a couple that lived so many years together: to reach a healthy old age she needed to have a lot of harmony during the life. Was this the case of you?

Lady Ester: In the beginning he was a little rude, but as times passed by he got better.

José of Neves: But in the beginning it was like this, see this chair? I would say this is a chair. She would say no, this is a seat, and then there was a fight. Until that one day Daime caught me and showed me that going that way, it wouldn't do. Then if she arrived home saying that this is a seat I would remain silent, but I was strong with my truth and her with hers. And the result which was? We strengthened my word and hers and we stopped discussing without need.

Varadouro: Daime comes from the forest and the forest is being finished around here, how it will be?

José das Neves: If you finish the forest, you can put an end to the humanity. This can be the end to all living being cause we live by the forest, and the forest by us. If humanity destroys the forest, then you can finish with the humanity cause it won't worth anything else. Do you know why? - The forest gives us life and life blows from there and cover the world.

Varadouro: And the Indians?

José das Neves: I believe they are superior Brazilians. They come from this ground and we came arranged from other places, because when Brazil was discovered they were already here, they already spoke with nature.